From Punky Van Tours to Global Festival Runs: An Interview with Tour Manager Jason

Career & Growth

LobbyCall: Every great Tour Manager has a "day one" story. How did you first get your boots on the ground in the touring industry, and what was the moment you realized this was your career path?

Jason: As a teenager, music was my passion, and when I went to college in 2009, I started a bachelor in business management, with a specialization in Event Management. Back in those days, this was a very business-oriented education, and with my dream of ending up in the music industry, I was the odd one out. In my final year, I did an internship at a music management company in Belgium, and that was my first real working experience in the industry. It was a very interesting time, yet I felt it wasn’t 100% up my alley, until one day I joined one of our bands for a show, and then things changed. I was instantly captivated by the machine that was put into motion to work towards the actual concert and thrived on the energy and anticipation prior to the show. At that moment, I knew that was what I wanted to do. After graduating, I continued my education with a specialization year at the Academy of Contemporary Music in Guildford, doing a Tour Management & Production course, and ever since then, I have been working on a career in the live music industry.

LobbyCal: How has your approach to the "business of the road" changed from your early tours to now managing global shows and festival runs?

Jason: Like so many people, I started out as a driver/tour manager on punky van tours. In retrospect, this had very little to do with tour management. My biggest task was getting the band to the venue on time; sometimes I’d be asked to send out a rider, and I had no clue what a settlement was.

Entering the wonderful world of budgeting and settlements, you start to realize how important a tour manager can actually be. It’s your experience, insights, and suggestions that will achieve the reason for which you’re hired: it’s not just about getting a band on stage, it’s making sure the artist walks away with as much money as possible. There’s no bigger thrill than finding a ‘mistake’ in a promoter settlement, earning your artist an extra amount of cash, and realizing you just earned your day rate with a good day at the office.

LobbyCall: You work with a wide range of talent, from Gregory Alan Isakov to Tower of Power. How do you adapt your management style to fit the unique "vibe" and legacy of such different artists?

Jason: Every team has a different dynamic. I often enter a production that has been on the road for months or even years, and it’s very important to respect whatever it is they have got going. There is really no point in barging in with a ‘my way or the highway’ attitude. At the same time, I believe it is not sustainable to put on an act or adapt to a style that isn’t yours. Sooner or later, you will either be caught out or frustration will catch up with you. I am a firm believer in talking with anyone involved before making decisions. I want to make sure people know that their experience and input matters, and I also don’t mind explaining why decisions have been made. In my experience, this approach gains you a lot of respect, however time and energy consuming it might be, and I believe it’s an investment in your future with that team.

To answer your question in a more direct fashion: I always dip my toes into the different aspects of the production to learn and understand the dynamics of the team, and will then apply my philosophy while looking for a balance between how things were done and how I want things to be done.

Planning & Logistics

LobbyCall: You were deeply involved in the full production planning for the recent US run and Coachella of Noga Erez. What are the first three things you look at when architecting a production of that scale?

Jason: Money, money, and money! No, on a serious note, the budget is obviously the most important thing. We all want a massive and impressive show, but some things just aren’t achievable with the money at hand. That said, I always encourage everyone to lay out their visions without being concerned about the budget. That way, you learn what the team considers to be the essential part of the production, and then you can focus on that and start building around that element.

Given the investment a new production usually is, I believe scalability is also a very important thing to consider, as venue sizes of the artists I work with can vary within a tour. I told my team to build a full-on show that can easily be reduced, depending on venue and stage size. This way, you only need to invest in one design, rather than having to backtrack later.

Finally, the logistics also shouldn’t be ignored: when touring with an artist that performs globally, you prefer to have, for example, your set pieces to be either at hand in the different markets or easily tourable when it comes to freight or shipping.

LobbyCall: When gear breaks down mid-tour or a flight is canceled, what is your personal process for staying calm and finding a solution that doesn't compromise the show?

Jason: There are many reasons to build a good relationship with your promoter during the advancing, but among those, you need to realise that when you end up in a situation where you are missing essential gear, the promoter is your best friend. They will have the connections, and they are your biggest hope in sourcing something last-minute or finding you a place to buy whatever it is you need.

When a flight is cancelled, first thing you do is of course check if you can still make it to the show in time, but if it turns out you can’t, and fortunately I haven’t been in this situation yet, I believe there is no point in having a mental breakdown over it. There is a thing called ‘the serenity prayer,’ and it goes like this:

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,

courage to change the things I can,

and wisdom to know the difference.

If you are stuck in traffic and have no place to go, there is nothing you can do about it. Don’t focus on being stuck, but get in touch with your promoter and see how much we can adapt the schedule. Make sure they are ready for you when you do get in. Keep a clear head and keep the peace.

LobbyCall: You are on tour with Tower of Power for the first time. How do you prepare for a first-time tour with a legendary act compared to an artist you’ve worked with for years?

Jason: As I previously mentioned I believe it is very important not to barge in and lay down your rules. Tower of Power is a band that started out 58 years ago, and I am fully aware they have pretty much seen it all by now. at the same time, they are undoubtedly adjusted to a certain workflow and schedule, and there is absolutely no reason for me to change that. At the same time, I can add my own touch. I can, for instance, use my own template of day sheets or communicate in a way that is more personally aligned with how I work. Of course, if the artist objects, I can adapt to that.

It’s also important to learn about what the artist thinks is important. For acts I have worked with in the past, I usually know what they value more than other things on a hospitality rider, so if I need to make some cuts to that list, I know what can and what can’t be taken off. Every artist also has their own pre-show rituals: some artists will do promo up to 30 minutes prior to a show (which I will avoid whenever I can), but others want to start preparing and focusing 3h before. As a standard, I will always book transportation for my artist from the hotel to the venue, but some artists prefer to go for a walk and have a coffee in town and are happy to book an Uber themselves whenever they are ready. It gives them a certain sense of freedom: they can still regulate part of their own day and don’t want me to get involved in their downtime. And of course, even within a production, every band member can have their own preferences. 

It’s those little things you need to familiarise yourself with. Ask everyone in a casual way and make sure they know you are there for them, in whichever way they prefer.

Finance & Transparency

LobbyCall: Many people think TMs just handle logistics, but you are essentially the CFO of the road. How do you balance an artist’s creative "must-haves" with the harsh reality of a tour budget?

Jason: I am a strong believer in an open conversation. It has happened to me a few times already that when you take over a tour from someone else, you feel that the production has grown into a culture of pleasing the artist’s requests, no matter what. I think in the long run, it is better to communicate openly about the consequences of their request: ‘yes, I can get you those ten bottles of champagne, but please be aware we have exceeded our hospitality budget for this show, and this expense will get charged back to you directly.’ A lot of the time, the artist will change their minds and will appreciate this rather than having a yes-man bowing for them and spending their money without them knowing.

The same thing applies to the overall touring budget. There’s not a single artist who wouldn’t like a full-on, spectacular production, but the reality of the budget often doesn’t reflect those desires. Initially, I will always let the artist go wild: we need to know what they envision. Once you know, you draft a budget and present it to them. This can turn into a conversation in which you need to tell them that touring in this fashion will cause a loss of x amount of money, but you could also still be making a decent profit. If that’s the case, a tour manager should already know how much more money there is to make if we can make a few concessions: if twenty dancers cost you $10,000/show, you can make $5,000 per show more if you are happy with just 10 of them. You need to find out what’s redundant in the production and what the key elements are in order to optimize your profit margins.

lobbyCall: In an industry where things can go wrong in a heartbeat, what are the intangible benefits of working with a "select few" vetted partners? How does that long-term trust change the way you sleep at night during a high-stakes tour?

Jason: I think every tour manager has their people to whom they will always reach out first. It’s not just about money; sometimes these aren’t even the cheapest options, but over the years, you have established a relationship of trust, through which you know you can rely on your crew of suppliers if needed. If something goes missing or breaks while on the road, you just know they’ll go the extra mile for you to get things fixed. 

At the same time, the supplier also knows what to expect. They are familiar with your workflow, know how to read your touring spreadsheets and will also want to make sure you keep calling them in the future.

LobbyCall: LobbyCall is built on the idea of a "Tour & Production Collective". How does being part of a group of like-minded managers help you stay at the top of your game, and how does that shared knowledge benefit the artists you work with?

Jason: It is great to know there is a team behind you at all times. We all tour all over the world and end up in places we have never been before. A classic question that pops up in pretty much every production group chat is about bus parking on off days. A lot of the time, there will be someone who can recommend a spot, often even providing you with a contact for that place instantly. 

As I am now growing into productions that require other suppliers than those that I have been working with in the past, it’s a great way to get recommendations for e.g. set designers, video operators, or suppliers in areas of the world where you haven’t been to before.

It gives a lot of peace of mind to know the recommendations you are getting aren’t ‘friends of …’ as you would get on Facebook groups or something. It also saves you loads of time, because you can narrow down your search from the get go.

The Big Picture

LobbyCall: Based on your experience, what is one "out of the box" change you’d like to see in how the touring industry handles procurement and partnerships? 

Jason: I believe in moving away from going for the cheapest option. If you are asking different companies to quote for the same things and the person you have been working with for years comes in 5% or even 10% more expensive than someone else, you should start a conversation and see if there’s anything to be done about that. As I said before, you also know what you can expect for that extra money: would you risk working with a supplier who has no resources to help you out if things go wrong, or even doesn’t really care because there’s no history with your production, just to save 3% of expenses on your overall budget? I’d prefer not to, and it’s important that your partner knows this. I will often tell my supplier when I am confirming a quote that they weren’t the cheapest option, followed by my reasoning to go with them after all. And if one day, you need a favor, you might actually be able to get it.

It’s important to note that at the same time, none of my collaborations is set in stone. If at a certain point the discrepancy between quotes gets too big, you should let them know. What can also happen is that your supplier starts taking you for granted, and their services start to slacken. That’s something I won’t stand for, and that’s when I’ll start exploring different pastures.

Photo's 📷 @shamrockraver